A forum for discussion on consciousness, what it is, how it can be manipulated, with the ultimate goal of enabling its transference to another containment outside the human body.
They promise the nuked entries will be restored.. If they are, I may republish them here. I was inspired and wrote prolifically, only to have all of that writing nuked hours after submitting the last one. I want to throw things.
Wrenj wrote: Recall the work of Leonardo da Vinci, as a painter, an engineer and an inventor. He was centuries ahead of his time.
What motivated his work?
I do believe that in some cases technology exists which the market might not be able to sustain and so is not released. In other cases other motives drive the non-release.
Since innovation is not the exclusive preserve of anyone, progress seems almost relentless.
Wrenj wrote: There is always the need to evaluate progress in the context of good and evil. We human beings must judge ourselves, what we do and how we do it. All the hazards, you both point out are very real. We've seen how manipulation is currently going on.
I can hardly imagine a case, even if theoretically it became possible to provoke the transfer of consciousness to an electronic network, how people would not seek special features and properties.
It would be just like blog themes or phone apps. Some would be free at a basic level, but others would come at a price for the corresponding features.
The contest will never cease, and so the requirements of an adequate moral framework will never cease, if only to guarantee a just outcome. But as our history and experience shows, there's hardly agreement on a common moral framework, much less agreement on its application.
The desire for heaven, however, seems intrinsic to our structure as human beings, a universe free of evil. Yet we never quite seem to manage to build heaven on earth. History, though, is not in short supply of those who have promised such.
The realization of these promises apart from being an exercise in futility, have been nothing short of exercises in bloodletting.
Patrick wrote: Wrenj, I apologize but I forgot to address the smoking earlier; I smoked for 25 years. I loved it. I still love the smell. I quit last August 15th. I smoked well over a pack a day if not two. How did I do it? Chantix and electronic cigarettes. When you start Chantix, you can "cheat" as you need to but the drug really does remove your cravings, physiologically at least. This is where the electronic cigarettes are essential. You only "smoke" what you need to get over the craving. If you torch up a real cigarette, you would likely smoke it to the butt like I would. This saturates you with nicotine whereas the electronic one would not with only a few drags. Dude, if it worked with me, it will work with anyone. Just ask Chris.
Wrenj wrote: The benefits of innovation are not limited to places in the developed world.
In India, domestic call rates on mobile phones have dropped to as low as 0.7 cents per minute. Compare that to domestic call rates in the US.
These rates have been achieved without the Indian government allowing full and unhindered IP telephony. Imagine what would happen to the rates, when this is allowed.
I could cite many such examples of great technology available at a fraction of the cost.
Patrick wrote: As for our predisposition towards distopian social nightmares, the "singularity" will offer an alternative. Remember my earlier post re: North Korea? Well, full immersion VR will be reality for people. Have's and have not's alike. However, they can have their magical gods and actually experience the miracles and such that are promised and have as yet remained undelivered.
Thought....with such evolutionary advancement, we as a species may have evolved past the need for gods, heaven, and the traditional sources for overreaching comfort and order. But for those who still need such things, the experience will seem more real.
Patrick wrote: A real problem in VR today is rendering cost. I can afford to pretty much have any pleasant and status offering object in VR but it's all for not if the server hosting the environment lags due to all my stuff. So the really cool people are minimalists to keep speeds up. Almost Buddism by necessity -lol
Patrick wrote: I would surmise that an individual's consciousness would live on a dedicated self contained portable network. I envision something the size of a cell phone, that can be attached to an artificial body if you desire one. If that portable network gets run over by a truck in real life, then you're toast. However, I would imagine most people would live in a virtual world while their hardware is sequestered in a secure facility somewhere. Like underground on the moon perhaps? Then we would interact virtually. However true damage would be limited and psychological at worst.
Lots of people balk at the idea of a virtual existence but what your mind can generate to fill in the gaps of today's technology is simply amazing. Imagine when technology leaves very little for your mind to engineer. Lots of people "live" in VR already to escape real life as often as they can. To them, current technology is able to set their minds to believing they're really there. And we're 35 years away from full immersion. Wow
Patrick wrote: And the older I get the more I resent my biological limitations. I feel like a helpless hostage adrift in a sinking ship. It seems arcane to be stuck in here.
Patrick wrote: Random thought: our brain is a digital computer of finite size and capacity. It runs on software. Some people believe that software is a transdimensional static entity known as a spirit. This is up for evaluation but when we have artificially duplicated our own complexity, I can imagine evolution will dictate software similar if not identical to our own. IF this is not the case, then this may be considered as evidence of the transdimensional / supernatural aspect.
Having said all that, my thought was simply this: We have a non-magical highly complex brain that we know is a digital computer running software. How freaking hard does this really have to be? Just saying....
Patrick wrote: More random thought... I wonder if we can gain some insight by observing how the brain (of any species) develops in vitro. What develops first? Why? Is this sequence necessary for natural software development? I'll bet we can learn quite a bit for our "cause" by watching how it's done in nature.
To reflect on the anti-gravity and super-light velocity problems, we can't observe such phenomena in nature. We can only speculate mathematically. Well as far as digital immortality is concerned, we can observe this in nature. In fact, I could live forever right now if I could digitize my DNA to eliminate the analog losses within cell reproduction.
Patrick wrote: More thoughts: It would seem this evolution for us is something that needs to happen for our survival. As a species we're still increasing in number. Something's got to break when we max this planet out. So then what will it be? A massive culling through disease, famine, and war? Or do we ditch our biology and consume massively fewer resources respectively?
Patrick wrote: Nicotine triggers a neural response. If you were digital you could still smoke. It would taste the same, feel the same, smell the same, and may even be addicting. But it wouldn't kill you, it would be free, and you could quit at any time.
Sounds like liberation to me. I could blow past my caloric daily intake and never gain an ounce :-D
Patrick wrote: As a joke, I could make a "window licking" program as pleasureful as the most addictive drug. I can see it now, vast numbers of digital people spending their existence licking windows. So I'd guess one of your security protocols would be protecting the pleasure centers of your consciousness. For they can motivate you to do virtually anything. Some entity could enlist you to perform mundane tasks for a job and pay you (or enslave you) by controlling those pleasure inputs.
To comment on Chris' post, "For the first time in history man has become one of the major forces in the process of evolution--or so it seems. But is it really evolution of man or somthing else?",
I feel that intelligence is an evolutionary entity in and of itself. In that once intelligence has evolved, it will continue advancing regardless of what platform it finds itself on. If we were silicon based, our intelligence would be evolving similarly (once sentience/awareness/consciousness has evolved).
It's a core belief (and hope) of mine that intelligence is mobile in that it can jump from one medium to another. If humans leave our biology in favor of silicon and other engineered materials, our intelligence remains intact and enhanced, even though our previous medium may cease to exist.
So then from this perspective, I would say it's "something else", and that something else would be intelligence itself.
Other planets can have radically different ecological systems, with methane lakes and elements in different proportions to that of earth. Such places would evolve very different forms of life, but the intelligences would be similar. Math is the same across the galaxy.
Came across something laughably interesting. Harold Camping believes that the "rapture" of the christians will happen on the 21st of this month. The world will then summarily end 5 years later (or 5 months, I forget). He claims roughly 3% of the human population will be included in those that are "raptured", leaving the rest of us to be destroyed. He also says that we won't be enduring eternal punishment in hell but rather be annihilated completely. Hmmm.
Adherents to his prediction are liquidating their retirement savings and possessions. I hope his followers will abandon their delusions come May 22nd. Tragic, it really is quite tragic.
I must admit I used to take such things seriously and with great hope. I'm grateful that I've been able to shed such delusional thinking. It really saddens me to see bronze-age ideologies dictating patterns of behavior in people today.
I suppose to be fair, each avenue of evolution needs its day in the sun. Religion has had quite a run but it's things like this Camping guy that signal the end is near not for the world but conversely, the ideology / theology that he proffers.
Here is really the crux of the indefinate dwelling in a computer cpu. WHO will be paying for your power needs, maintenance, upgrades etc. I would assume that every few years there would need to be maintenances and changes. Who would be earning the monies to pay for your indefinate existance. What if that person stopped paying the monthly storage and power bills? would "they" pull your plug?
Would you really be able to set up a "trust" that you could really trust to take care of these costs for the unforseen milenia to come? Just another damn big problem in the scheme of things.
Wrenj, I used to smoke as well. I LOVED it. I would smoke today if I thought my body could handle the cancer causing chemicals--again( I have had really bad cancer once already). I still really love the smell of a freshly lit ciggarette. It's right up there with deisel bus exhaust and rubber tires and printing ink. I can't explain why I just love those smells.
Odors would seem to be one of those things that would be wiped out if we were relagated to exist inside of a data storage device. aroma and odors are such an integral part of the human experience that I thing we would no longer qualify as 100% whole persons without the ability to smell--smelling is a huge psychological component to our experience that is taken for granted.
After smoking for 10 years, I quit Nov 17, 1996.I can say you never truely loose the desire to light up every now and then. Allot of it is because it que's memories from your past.
Chris, smells are a neurological signal just like vision and taste and hearing and touch. If we have replicated the brain, don't you think we can replicate the senses too? (and allow for the emotional content that results)
As for who runs the world and takes care of the digital masses.... that's an excellent question. Well, if you can be contained in a portable network device the size of a cell phone, couldn't you fit that into a body? Who's to say there won't be meaningful work for people in the physical world as well as the digital one? Ditching natural biology doesn't necessarily mean an end to physical existence. Just an end to being confined by it.
"I regard the brain as a computer which will stop working when its components fail. There is no heaven or afterlife for broken down computers; that is a fairy story for people afraid of the dark."
I signed up today with a professional hypnotist. This lady will be regressing me to a point of past lives with the goal of getting to my inter-life state(my existance state between human lives) where I should have access to my spirit guide(s)/ guide pannel of elders who originally set me up with my current life contract. The goal is to meet these entities while still incarnate--something that very few people get to do. Normally we see these beings after we die and have our life review and before this life while establishing our life contract and goals.
Of course all of the above is conjecture until proven, so I shall see if this is for real or a total load of BS. It costs $600 dollars for the two sessions (8hrs total). I hope to discover more about the etheric realms where we come from and go back to when we are not incarnate as physical beings--I'm excited and have no real expectations either way right now. I am keeping my mind open.
Evidence would include information privy to you during a prior life that can be acted upon in this life. For example, you recall a memory from a prior life of burying something identifiable and then go uncover the object in this life. Better yet, tell us what this object is and then go dig up that same object that you had described. In so doing, you make this exercise statistically more significant.
If you really believe you have something of scientific value, I would enlist some researchers from UofW to accompany you prior to any unearthing endeavors. Undergrads are trained in the scientific method and can help you engineer any experiments to hold their own merit in the face of scrutiny from the scientific community. Grad students would be better for the sake of credibility.
It would be really, REALLY cool to make the first evidence of a "fantastic event" bulletproof and world changing.
I'll start commenting on the latest posts first and then work my way backwards.
I do not see how the work of a hypnotist can be verified. This ranks in the category of Chris's earlier OBE/NDE experience. This is not to say that what Chris experienced earlier is untrue or an illusion.
It simply means that the analogical steel door still stands firmly in front of us. We can go to the other side of our choosing. We can't return of our choosing.
The fact that we don't control the door, does not make it consistent to say there is no door or nothing on the other side.
Stephen Hawking, in this regard, is just as helpless as you and I. However, we can each choose to believe what we wish, whether our beliefs meet the test of adequacy or not.
Recall Richard Feynman's description of science...always the return to reality for a check. Reality out there, outside our minds, remains the reference for Truth.
As for the coming hypnotic experience, with the use of the word hypnosis, there's already a question mark hanging over the entire issue. It is defined as an "artificially induced trance state resembling sleep, with a heightened susceptibility to suggestion" (dictionary.com)
Now which suggestions can we become susceptible to?
Considering Patrick's reference to Harold Camping and others' susceptibility while they're wide awake (doing things with real consequences as a result) what would we then say of information absorbed in a state of hypnosis?
"Astral Travel" or lucid out of body experiences must begin with a trance state. The hardest "trick" is remembering what your subconscious experienced. Like recalling a dream before it dissipates. Whether Astral Travel is actually what its proponents claim or just lucid dreaming, it appears very much like hypnosis on the label. I would be interested to know if Chris' experience shares any aspects with Astral Travel.
Random thought: consider the effects on an environment of a single fecund successful breeding pair of some species. They alter the environment in proportion to their replication. Now consider a nanotech network. It gets dropped into an environment and starts to establish itself. First building a base of operations which includes repair, research, raw material acquisition, communications, and energy. If the environment can sustain them, what would the environment look like? I was standing outside just now looking out over the landscape visualizing these little pods descending from space, filled with nanites. Wherever they land, vehicles crewed with sentient humanoid lifeforms would emerge, completely manufactured on site from local materials. What a thought to share over morning coffee!
A little more about the quote from the Stephen Hawking. I think it would be more adequate to include an "If...then..." to yield a more useful statement for our purposes.
"IF
I regard the brain as a computer which will stop working when its components fail,
THEN
There is no heaven or afterlife for broken down computers; that is a fairy story for people afraid of the dark."
Stephen Hawking here uses the argumentative device of reducing the human being to a computer (disputed elsewhere on this blog) as settled fact and then deriving some conclusions from it.
We'd have to take Stephen Hawking's word for that reduction. We'd have to believe him. We'd have to have faith in what he says. I disagree, because the reality outside the mind (his mind and my mind and all minds) seems to indicate otherwise.
Now since computers don't come to exist miraculously...we necessarily have to add one more element:
f(modem)
It's only with a modem-like component (whether hardware of software) that it could even power up, and later do more. Without this translation component, press the power switch and nothing happens...but in actual fact there is a process of encoding (at time of manufacture), decoding (each time the computer is used) and subsequent execution.
1. Press the power switch.
2. Complete the circuit.
3. Power up ROM.
4. Do a self-check.
and on and on.
In the ROM is a set of instructions that the CPU can translate, understand and begin to execute. By necessity the modem component is already at play.
Now the two equations
Human being = f...
Computer = f...
differ by several orders of magnitude and are neither identical nor equal though they may contain a few similar elements.
Penicillin: f (R), f (H), f (O), f (S), f (C), f (N)
R - variable group that gives rise to the different kinds of penicillin N - Nitrogen C - Carbon
The formulas show that both Sulphuric acid and Penicillin contain identical elements but are not equal, identical and have vastly different properties and effects.
It is only by discovering the formulas of each that begin to understand some aspects of the "Why?" of both having vastly different effects.
Actually it's from the effects that we realize there is a difference and begin to work backward to the component elements.
The Singularity of Ray Kurzweil has one basic premise:
Human being = f....
has all been worked out.
Ordinary people themselves get baffled by themselves and others. Scientists only get more awed the deeper they delve into molecular biology or the universe out there.
Now consider a song on your computer. It is stored in a specific format designed by humans taking various considerations into mind.
The song can be played by specific programs on the computer. Here file is translated by the program and then used to control the components of the speakers.
When we're transferring the file to say an iPod, a different program goes to work on the file again translating it into another kind of code which is then sent through the USB port to the music player device.
The receiving program then stitches together the received file which is then taken by the file system of the iPod and stored where the user wants it.
Finally the music player program in the iPod translates the file again when it is played and uses it to control the components of a set of speakers or earphones.
In all these cases there is full understanding of aspects of the original mp3 file by the interpreting program. In the case of the music player program, it reads the sequences of 1s and 0s, classifies into data aspects, control aspects and then plays the file. So a text file (.TXT) would make no sense if fed into a music player program.
Again the same mp3 file is read by the file-transfer program reading the 1s and 0s. It is able to successfully send the file to the iPod. It can if need be even send a Text file because it is designed to handle a greater variety of files.
The nature of the files themselves determine which programs can use them.
Right now the biological aspects of the human "file" are being understood by science. There is evidence of other bridges that transmit data to the human being. Those aspects of the file are even less understood.
It's only with full understanding that unaltered transfer can take place.
There is no guarantee that a biological-silicon communication channel with modems on both sides will transfer the whole file. Simply because we have not worked out what the whole file is.
Again Chris's experience here indicates an existence completely independent of the biological and known material universe. He gives us a glimpse of it by describing an effect: instantaneous motion.
He did not remain sufficiently long in his OBE to experience other effects. He returned to our realm again, not of his own choosing.
Imagine putting a 3D version of the Avatar movie into the video player and plugging the audio and video cables to the printer and pressing play on the video player and print on the printer.
This is how I understand and see an attempt at transfer from the human body to silicon.
Since science is understanding some of the components a bit more clearly, it becomes possible to design technology that interfaces with specific aspects.
A simple example is the hearing aid. Once the mechanism of the ear was understood, it became possible to design hearing aids that interfaced with that specific aspect of the biological system which again is one aspect of the human being.
The more the ear is understood, the better the technology that is designed to interface with it.
The same can be applied to the eyes. Years ago there was bad eyesight and blindness. As understanding has grown about the optic system, eyeglasses, medicines, synthetic lenses have all slowly become mainstream.
We even saw technology being developed that can stimulate the visual cortex of the brain so that one day totally blind people could again begin to see. How is all this possible? Again better understanding of the optic system.
My hope is to see children taking a school trip to Mars in my lifetime and having those skateboards fitted with rockets like the green goblin had in Spider Man. The rockets though should be much faster and have greater range.
We could get to hang out on weekends in say the rift valley in Kenya.
I just instructed blogger to email each comment to not only my iPhone but to a fixed computer with a unique email address so now there will be two copies of everything.
f(magic) seems to be where our thoughts diverge. Neurons are digital switches like relays and transistor junctions. It's not as distant as sulphuric acid and penicillin. It's apples and apples when you consider the human brain and computers because they're both computers.
Your comments did however make me consider chemical interactions on the neural processes. Dopamine, serotonin, nicotine, etc.. chemistry targets only specific neurons and then suggests those that are targeted fire in a certain way or sequence. That's interesting. That's also an algorithm, transmitted chemically. So sure, the technology is pretty different but it's still apples and apples with no f(magic).
Today, humans and computers ARE different by several orders of magnitude. I'll give you that because it's not 35 years from now, it's still today. Consider the state of the art even 20 years ago. The 8080 processor. If you were really cool, you had the 8087 math co-processor alongside it. Then within 5 years we had the 486 and glossed over the 286 and 386 in a matter of months. Then the Pentium etc etc. (Motorola was also developing their own architectures for the Macs.)
I have taken files and altered their extensions. You can take an .mp3 file and change it to a .txt file and read the ASCII contents with a text reader. My mac will even list off several applications suitable for such a task. After cruising around the file, you can restore the extension and carry on with the .mp3 or whatever it was.
You mention the hearing aid,… have you heard of the cochlear implant? Think BORG -lol
So then, the f(human) does seem magical in comparison to the technology of today but what I ask is that we consider the possibility that it's not f(magic), just beyond our current capabilities to master and quantify.
I suspect the trends of ergonomics will continue and as the two lines converge, bio and tech, that the two will resemble each other until there is virtually no difference. Tech will go bio and bio will go tech.
Also, comparing contemporary computers to humans would also be akin to comparing humans with our evolutionary predecessors.. There's just no direct comparison other than seeing the potential evolutionary outcome and similar structures (architecture) and realizing the long term convergences. Doing this with bio vs tech is similar except the time frames are greatly accelerated.
And who's to say we don't have a boot sequence when our consciousness takes the helm every morning, or when we come out of anesthesia, or when we're born?
And to digress, the 3D>Printer analogy fails to take the timeframe into account. We are not yet to a place to attempt a transfer to silicon *today*. Where I suspect we are today is neural interfacing and attempts at neural awareness of artificial arrays. (Recall the need to text and drive). We are still at a highly primitive state, just as my first computer was compared to what's at my disposal today. As far as f(unknown) and f(magic), I'd say just wait and give technology a chance. I bet it will surprise you.
But hey, it's all irrelevant because the god of the christians is coming this saturday to bring about the beginning of the end. So we're all doomed and will never live long enough to develop technology any further. Darn.
OBE/NDE/Astral Travel just won't leave me alone though. There's something there, be it real or imagined. Too many people have experienced something that we haven't nailed down yet. It could be purely physiological but there's no proof of that. So, there being no proof on either side of the isle, I figure investigating the more interesting ideas as being just as valid as the brick and mortar science.
Someone needs to play "tell me what's in the box" and nail it. If that happens, the world will change overnight.
f (magic) and f (mystery) are two entirely different things.
Magic points to the human control of supernatural forces or forces of nature. Often it's just a case of creating an illusion and manipulating the attention of the viewer. Later we uncover the secret and all is explained.
Mystery refers to the unexplained, the inexplicable. This is a perennial feature of life.
There are some mysteries of a material order like the disappearance of a ship or the effects of a crime or even mysteries in science.
There are other mysteries that are not yet explained like inexplicable cases of healing, which believers take as miracles. Not all cases called miracles are actually miracles. But there are cases that have no ordinary explanation.
There are other mysteries that we have probed and are still probing. Who am I? Why am I here? Why am I not a plant? Why did that happen to me? Why is this happening to me? Why is there evil and suffering? Is there a God? If so, why does He allow the mess that I often see and leaves me worn out? How could I have done that good or evil? What happens after death?
There are universal mysteries and deeply personal mysteries. I'm sure Chris would wonder why he had the experience and not others in the same room with him. And those who know Chris closely are taking his experience seriously. They too must be wondering what happened? We too.
The first time we come across a mirror, it almost seems like magic. Then later we understand the physics and all is explained.
For as long as humans have existed, we not only encounter mysteries in the world around us, but we are often a mystery to ourselves.
If death were not so mysterious, we wouldn't be chasing the "immortalities" on offer.
So true. I've found myself asking, "Would I care about digital immortality or the singularity if I knew for sure there were a spirit world offering the same thing naturally?". I would immerse myself in f(magic) and be quite content in the world, taking comfort in knowing what's to come and how I fit into all of it.
It's quite scary to abandon all the established "fairy stories" and have nothing to replace them with aside from raw science.
Evolution is a hypothesis for which the key elements are still missing. But for some strange (or not so strange) reason it has acquired the status of dogma.
Evolution as a concept clearly can be applied to human social organizations. It perfectly fits. Again evolution within species is showing good evidence and well explains the development of features.
But evolution across species and evolution as the explanation for the appearance of man has still not met the test of scientific rigor while it has long past met with indiscriminating acceptance in some very influential quarters.
So popular (in contrast to scientifically rigorous) notions aside, this still leaves a big f(mystery) around the human being. This is why there may be similar elements between computers and humans, the similarity more being in those aspects of being human that are less mysterious to us.
Again, Chris's unaided instantaneous motion (completely unregistered by others in the room or devices in the room) in his OBE experience has no parallels except in other OBE experiences.
There are stars that have died out in the universe and we're yet to know because light travels only so fast. Chris and others are having their experiences, smack in our midst, and we're still scratching our heads.
Faith, courage, hope, good, evil are all mysterious notions and have been for a while. Along comes miracles, OBEs etc. and f(mystery) becomes only more mysterious.
Wrenj. I finally now thoroughly understand your equasion on life. Thanks much for the in depth explanations. I really believe that the f(mystery) component to human existance is where we are different from the computer CPU in that there is this "spiritual"component. Our minds and brains being seperate components with different opperational tasks. When I died my mind was fully in tact with a sense of self, memory both short and long term, and a physical sense(although altered). My senses were in tact although I cannot confirm smell/taste but hearing, sight, feeling/touch I can definately confirm. I suspect the reason I can't confirm smell/taste is because I wasn't breathing and breathing something is a necessary component to this sense.
I am still torn about what I think about seeing a hypnotist. It seemed like the logical thing to do in order to bring more insight into my experience(s) I don't go in to see her until June 2, 2011.
In the mean time I am further researching the validity of this area of psychology/medicine/science/ ???.
Hypnosis has the nod of the American Medical Assoc. and all of the European health care systems and is considered valid medical treatment--ESPECIALLY in the area of anastethia!. Many medical and dental proceedures are now carried out under no anastethia but simple hypnosis. This leads me to know that there is a definate mind body sensory divorce that can be instituted at will and by a third party. (divorce used for lack of a better term) It proves that by thought we can alter our perception of reality. Could they do a heart transplant under hypnosis? I don't know
It has been lended legitimaticy by the US legal system when doing research for court cases and victim recall and is considered legal evidence in many cases of high crime and assult/murder type cases.
I am very curious to know how hypnosis and the mind is viewed in the greater Asian/Indian countries as those countries have so many differing religious views and at the same time are so highly educated and full of intellectuals.
The bottom line is that there IS something there and I won't be happy until i have a really good grip on how it works and how the human mind can exist outside of the brain.
"Who am I? Why am I here? Why am I not a plant? Why did that happen to me?", the beginning questions of the consciousness question. I re-ground myself frequently by going back to the very first moment of this line of thinking. I pause my day and my thoughts and really ask myself, "why am I stuck in here?". This soon leads me in the correct orientation to focus on my consciousness objectively as a single entity.
And yes, why am I not a plant? Why can't I leave this body and go into another one? Do I even need a body? These questions need answers and this blog was created to find them. We can hit this from any number of angles, psychological, mathematical, experiential, economical, and common sense approaches. Eventually we will ask the right questions in such a way that the answer will be forced out, or so we can hope.
I love it that Chris is being proactive with his hypnosis regressive therapy. I sincerely hope it produces results.
I own two books by Robert Bruce on Astral Travel where he delves into the very nature of our consciousness itself and tries to understand it via the fantastic events he and others claim to be having. His approach is commendable as well; "Don't take my word for it, go try it for yourself and here's how to do it.". I've tried and have had mixed results. Then I essentially stopped my enthusiasm cold by asking if all that I experienced could've been generated by my own imagination. I couldn't refute that possibility so the whole exercise imploded in my mind. If I or others could've played the "tell me what's in the box" game with statistically significant results, this blog would not have existed and I'd be off in the aetheric dimensions right now. It's telling that nobody has ever played that game with true success. Out of the billions of us that have ever existed, where's the f(magic)?? I would love to see that as much as I would love to see digital immortality. I am afraid of the dark as Hawking puts it. I also love the truth and a good mystery. I think out of the three of us, and maybe others out there following this blog, we stand a pretty good chance at getting some pretty interesting data at the very least.
Pat, I wil try to play "what's in the box" but I'm not sure how these sessions will go and what influences the information I am privey to. The hypnotist lady did tell me in my pre-screening session that I will not be able to gleen lottery numbers stock quotes etc- highly specific info from the future.
I will be allowed to review my life contract which does have some components from the future involved. As far as specific ascertainable information from the past that I/you could research and validate, I shall try very hard. The problem with that is that if it is info that is not available today I don't see how it could then be validated. It would be subject to that Hawking paradox theory for time travel.
Wrenj touched on something I have always wondered about but have never thought through. That is; everything on our planet including us is comprised of a fairly small set of common molecules and atoms.
Is there some form of matter that could be made or in existence which is of a basic "stem cell" nature? Where simply adding or removing one or two components could be instantly made into anything physical. I'm refering to a base molecule where it could be used as a seed for teleportation expiriments. So far H is the closest thing I can think of but it's too basic. We put this "stem seed" in front of some smart beam and it instantly assembles into the form desired. Just a wild idea!
Pat, I hope you are enjoying your new satus as a blog god. It does seem to suit you.
Congrats on the quit smoking! I didn't realize you had really honestly quit for good this time. Maybe it'll add the extra years that need to make it into a state of VR immorality!
Yes, I've been tobacco free since August 15th, 2010. I still love the smell of it and sometimes wish I had one but it's an easy matter to refuse the temptation now.
It seems interesting that peering into the future is restricted when the spirit world is supposed to be outside of time. The guy(s) that wrote the Astral Travel books use the phrase "somewhen" instead of "somewhere" to indicate they believe they're not confined by linear time as we in the physical are. They even report to be able to achieve super-light velocities as they have no mass and thus aren't constrained to the laws of physics. One account even said they could tour the inside of stars.
So you have to ask yourself why the temporal restriction while in a superconscious state? It would instantly prove its validity if the restriction didn't exist.
Will you be independently recording the session(s) to make sure she's not suggesting memory content for you? In college I remember that being a huge confound to hypnotic practice. The hypnotist would suggest things in the course of questioning and actually manufacture content within the mind of the patient. Ideally, she should be like a psychiatrist, asking "how do you feel about that?" and leaving you to do the work with only small course corrections along the way.
If you record the session(s) and hear her manufacturing fantastic events and planting them into your mind, I would ask for your money back.
Evolution and missing data: I have read most of the collective works of Zecharia Sitchin and among other things, he studied the ancient Sumerian / Akkadian records. These writings are the oldest known on the planet and they have an interesting tale to tell, especially about our own evolution. They, and the artifacts surrounding them lend enough evidence to validate their content as factual and not hearsay. There is still room for doubt but there is enough evidence for even me to give the nod of believability to the tales they tell.
They also predate the bible and I've noticed that the stories they contain were borrowed by the authors of the bible. However, with a spin and significant reduction in size. The "reader's digest" version if you will. The Sumerians spoke of "gods" too, but were quite analytical about what they saw. Sure it was all f(magic) to them but they still approached the whole situation with a sound mind. Their sculptures weren't stylized images of fanciful monsters either. If you could go back in time and show these people a Buick, they would've carved a pretty good image of a Buick in stone to keep a record of the object, also including the best description they could on the event.
Such a history of humanity, with "gods" from outer space seems fanciful at best, until you look at the evidence. There's just too much to discount the whole thing out of hand.
Something else about these "gods" is they seem to appear in our evolutionary timeframe in a cyclical way. They arrive, boost our society, and leave. Humanity flourishes and then begins to decay, just in time for the "gods" to return and revitalize us with another evolutionary sociological boost. On it goes every 3000 or so years. Huh. Wonder when they're supposed to be here next? Perhaps it will be they that introduce the Singularity, our next big evolutionary step? If they want any part in the process, they better show up quick before we do it on our own. -lol
A friend suggested today that the economic model will be the reason the Singularity won't happen or if it does, will be throttled way back. He said it's all about profit. If they can't find a way to make digital integration profitable, then it won't happen unless some other group that's well funded and altruistic protects its development.
Hmmm, perhaps it will require a group of gods to make it all happen?
HEAT. Our technology, which is way behind our own brains for now, runs really quite hot. Does my brain get hot when it's under load? I really don't think copper/silicon will be around for much longer as the medium / stratum of our technology. Moore's law is being threatened by the limits of physics in this regard. I'll make another prediction here on the blog;
Technology will have a whole new medium in the next 10 years.
Furthermore, I'll bet the new medium will take us in the right direction to the bio / tech convergence I wrote of earlier.
I'll bet it'll be much more energy efficient and thermally cooler.
I'll bet it will allow another order of magnitude of miniaturization and circuit density. "Gray matter" if you will.
It'll make the ideas of this blog seem almost inevitable.
Interesting thought.... en route to this convergence, maybe we could have technology augmenting our own brains that would allow us to better understand what's going on when we experience fantastic events. Like when Chris is interfacing the controllers of his destiny. Upon his return, he'll be able to see exactly what was going on physiologically in his mind during that same timeframe.
It may not hold the smoking gun of evidence but it will at least offer insight and data that may help us understand f(mystery) a little better. -just a thought.
Electron flow on the surface of the metal/mineral is what produces the heat right?. I suppose it is due to friction between molecules or else collisions between electrons.I realize that the textbok says that resistance/inductance is the cause of the heat but what IS resistance/inductance besides friction.
All we need to do is elevate the electrons onto a magnetic cushion off of the copper or conductor and loose this friction. There would no longer be the interferance of the conductor's molecular surface with electron transfer.
Nikola Tesla was touting this idea way back when he was working on wireless transmission of electricity. You shoot a path of "electronic gas" and within this jet of gas you can have a zero resistance super conductor--no heat waste. Same idea but using magnetics to contain the electron pathway.
Would that even work? Could I make a circuit on a glass or whatever substraight with a magnetite/magnetic carbon based conductive path where the electron flow gets raised onto the skin of the magnetic field? I can see it as kind of a reverse electro-magnet where electron flow becomes the "field effect" of the magnetic core. Maybe I'm just thinking out of my ass but it seems simple and like it just might be valid.
As far as getting hypnotized, yes the session includes a video recording on a DVD.
I did ask her how the whole suggestive thing works and she said she will be queing me but will not be putting ideas in my head for me to expound on. She said it is more or less an interview and I just report what I see and hear.
I do need to prepare list of questions and give her an idea of what I want to dig for. I have never done this so aside from reading up on life between lives I can't even begin to know what to expect.
I think if I go back for an extra follow up session at that time I could really get very specific as far as what I want to ask myself in the alternate dimention. She claims that it is "unethical" for her to use foresight to make profit in an un-natural way and that there would be a "high price to pay". I will probe her further about this, as this could just be the area where some real validation could occur.
Electronic gas, that's awesome! The conductivity of air goes up when it's heated. Consider the plasma torch. Cool it down and resistance goes up I would assume. Electrons travel on the surface of a conductor with penetration being a function of the frequency of the current. DC goes through the conductor. AC travels on the skin. This is called "skin effect". Microwave frequencies are barely in contact hence how waveguides can work. "G-line" also works due to this phenomenon but must remain absolutely straight. G-line is a single conductor with waveguide horns at either end. The losses along this transmission line are extremely low at microwave frequencies but it's impractical in most applications.
Take the frequency even higher and you get into lightwaves and they don't penetrate conductors at all. "Skin Effect" is the proper term for this and that would be the term to Google for further study.
Anyway, if it's not traveling through a conductor, then it's traveling through something if not in a perfect vacuum. This means resistance of some kind which directly translates to heat. So then, this is an f(mystery) why our brains don't get hot under load. I would like an answer to that one.
OMG everyone, tomorrow is the end of the world. (Harold Camping's prediction). I wonder what time this is all supposed to go down? I wonder how long Blogger will remain functional once all the christians are gone? How are we going to cope? Will god have mercy on all the people that are left or are we just going to be smitten by his wrath? Guess we'll know on Sunday.
Most rare gasses have conductive ability and can become a form of"electronic gas".Take neon for example it excites and flows a high voltage and produces light to boot. I need to re read my Tesla Book and find where he was working out these details.
The thought I have also had running around my head is this: Maybe the reason that magnetic fields can produce "spiritual" feelings and sensations in the brain are because the spirit realms are operate in a magnetic subspectrum.
I think there might be a way to isolate different bandwidths within the magnetic spectrum. These would be similar to energy bands of radio, light , and radiation but different forms of magnetism. We have a handle on magnetic flux inducing voltage etc, we see the effects of magnetism but it seems like there has to be more to it. So I'm on a new found quest.
Chris, I think you're referring to the "God Helmet". A device made by researcher Michael Persinger. He uses electromagnetic fields on the brain to stimulate certain feelings. It's really quite interesting. Google him.
If you're still able to that is. After the christians are gone, it's going to be pure pandemonium as all of us sinners will be under judgement for our evil ways. Better Google it fast before you end up in hell. -lmao
You know, I can't help but notice a feeling when I consider the state of the art in our area of focus... it feels just like it did when I was getting into serious computing back in the 80's. There was an interest but also a primitiveness about it all too. And now look how far we've come since then. If nano-tech and AI are giving me the same "feeling" today, then I sincerely hope it's a reliable indicator of where we'll be in the future.
When something becomes fossil, minerals take the place of organic matter. So when you see a fossil, you're not looking at the actual bone but rather minerals that have leached in through the parent rock and taken its place, molecule by molecule.
Now consider nano-tech. I believe such replacement will be the way of our eventual augmentation. Recall the convergence theory I spoke of, this will completely bypass the whole "age of robots" that have been so popular in movies (Bicentennial Man, etc.). Unless you really want to look like a metal robot, I don't think we'll ever see them.
This will also be the key to my reaching the age where digital immortality will be a viable option. As nano-tech evolves, it will invariably be used to augment my other organs and tissues hence aiding in my longevity. Then the holy grail will happen, neural replacement....one nano-device at a time. Before long I will have become 100% artificial. Downloading my consciousness into another device will by that time be ancillary and "no big deal".
I've made an assumption. Consequently I'm guilty of technological myopia. I've assumed the ultimate end to this evolution will be similar to the liquid metal guy in the movie Terminator 2.
Who's to say the spiritual realm, if it exists, isn't technology in its own right? I'm not saying that it is, just asking "what if".
1) Our unique consciousness must necessarily be hosted by a network. 2) We are software that is dependent upon said network. 3) Time may suspend for us indefinately but we can resume if the memory isn't erased. (Freezing one's brain might actually just work IF the memory is stable without being energized).
So then, can a network exist in other dimensions like the "spirit world" etc? Are such dimensions capable of maintaining complex arrays or structures necessary for making a network like the human brain?
They promise the nuked entries will be restored.. If they are, I may republish them here. I was inspired and wrote prolifically, only to have all of that writing nuked hours after submitting the last one. I want to throw things.
ReplyDeleteDuh, I have copies!!! I'll get to working on restoring the lost content right away!
ReplyDeleteWrenj wrote:
ReplyDeleteRecall the work of Leonardo da Vinci, as a painter, an engineer and an inventor. He was centuries ahead of his time.
What motivated his work?
I do believe that in some cases technology exists which the market might not be able to sustain and so is not released. In other cases other motives drive the non-release.
Since innovation is not the exclusive preserve of anyone, progress seems almost relentless.
Wrenj wrote:
ReplyDeleteThere is always the need to evaluate progress in the context of good and evil. We human beings must judge ourselves, what we do and how we do it. All the hazards, you both point out are very real. We've seen how manipulation is currently going on.
I can hardly imagine a case, even if theoretically it became possible to provoke the transfer of consciousness to an electronic network, how people would not seek special features and properties.
It would be just like blog themes or phone apps. Some would be free at a basic level, but others would come at a price for the corresponding features.
The contest will never cease, and so the requirements of an adequate moral framework will never cease, if only to guarantee a just outcome. But as our history and experience shows, there's hardly agreement on a common moral framework, much less agreement on its application.
The desire for heaven, however, seems intrinsic to our structure as human beings, a universe free of evil. Yet we never quite seem to manage to build heaven on earth. History, though, is not in short supply of those who have promised such.
The realization of these promises apart from being an exercise in futility, have been nothing short of exercises in bloodletting.
Patrick wrote:
ReplyDeleteWrenj, I apologize but I forgot to address the smoking earlier; I smoked for 25 years. I loved it. I still love the smell. I quit last August 15th. I smoked well over a pack a day if not two. How did I do it? Chantix and electronic cigarettes. When you start Chantix, you can "cheat" as you need to but the drug really does remove your cravings, physiologically at least. This is where the electronic cigarettes are essential. You only "smoke" what you need to get over the craving. If you torch up a real cigarette, you would likely smoke it to the butt like I would. This saturates you with nicotine whereas the electronic one would not with only a few drags. Dude, if it worked with me, it will work with anyone. Just ask Chris.
Wrenj wrote:
ReplyDeleteThe benefits of innovation are not limited to places in the developed world.
In India, domestic call rates on mobile phones have dropped to as low as 0.7 cents per minute. Compare that to domestic call rates in the US.
These rates have been achieved without the Indian government allowing full and unhindered IP telephony. Imagine what would happen to the rates, when this is allowed.
I could cite many such examples of great technology available at a fraction of the cost.
Patrick wrote:
ReplyDeleteAs for our predisposition towards distopian social nightmares, the "singularity" will offer an alternative. Remember my earlier post re: North Korea? Well, full immersion VR will be reality for people. Have's and have not's alike. However, they can have their magical gods and actually experience the miracles and such that are promised and have as yet remained undelivered.
Thought....with such evolutionary advancement, we as a species may have evolved past the need for gods, heaven, and the traditional sources for overreaching comfort and order. But for those who still need such things, the experience will seem more real.
Patrick wrote:
ReplyDeleteI would consider India part of the modern developed world though.
Wrenj wrote:
ReplyDeleteHow would disguises work if the transfer to electronic networks became possible?
Would it be a network that insisted on full transparency?
What would happen if some part of my algorithm got stolen?
What if some guy with a disorder pulled the plug on the part of the network I was roaming on?
Would we all have to go through some kind of verification and approval before being allowed to be uploaded?
Who would make the rules then?
What if I lost some vital part due to a malfunction during transfer?
Patrick wrote:
ReplyDeleteA real problem in VR today is rendering cost. I can afford to pretty much have any pleasant and status offering object in VR but it's all for not if the server hosting the environment lags due to all my stuff. So the really cool people are minimalists to keep speeds up. Almost Buddism by necessity -lol
Patrick wrote:
ReplyDeleteSuch concerns like those Wrenj do keep me up at night pondering.
Patrick wrote:
ReplyDeleteI would surmise that an individual's consciousness would live on a dedicated self contained portable network. I envision something the size of a cell phone, that can be attached to an artificial body if you desire one. If that portable network gets run over by a truck in real life, then you're toast. However, I would imagine most people would live in a virtual world while their hardware is sequestered in a secure facility somewhere. Like underground on the moon perhaps? Then we would interact virtually. However true damage would be limited and psychological at worst.
Lots of people balk at the idea of a virtual existence but what your mind can generate to fill in the gaps of today's technology is simply amazing. Imagine when technology leaves very little for your mind to engineer. Lots of people "live" in VR already to escape real life as often as they can. To them, current technology is able to set their minds to believing they're really there. And we're 35 years away from full immersion. Wow
Patrick wrote:
ReplyDeleteAnd the older I get the more I resent my biological limitations. I feel like a helpless hostage adrift in a sinking ship. It seems arcane to be stuck in here.
Patrick wrote:
ReplyDeleteRandom thought: our brain is a digital computer of finite size and capacity. It runs on software. Some people believe that software is a transdimensional static entity known as a spirit. This is up for evaluation but when we have artificially duplicated our own complexity, I can imagine evolution will dictate software similar if not identical to our own. IF this is not the case, then this may be considered as evidence of the transdimensional / supernatural aspect.
Having said all that, my thought was simply this: We have a non-magical highly complex brain that we know is a digital computer running software. How freaking hard does this really have to be? Just saying....
Patrick wrote:
ReplyDeleteMore random thought... I wonder if we can gain some insight by observing how the brain (of any species) develops in vitro. What develops first? Why? Is this sequence necessary for natural software development? I'll bet we can learn quite a bit for our "cause" by watching how it's done in nature.
To reflect on the anti-gravity and super-light velocity problems, we can't observe such phenomena in nature. We can only speculate mathematically. Well as far as digital immortality is concerned, we can observe this in nature. In fact, I could live forever right now if I could digitize my DNA to eliminate the analog losses within cell reproduction.
Patrick wrote:
ReplyDeleteAnd I'd tweak a few things along the way. I could be a designer human within the seven year cellular replacement cycle.
Patrick wrote:
ReplyDeleteMore thoughts: It would seem this evolution for us is something that needs to happen for our survival. As a species we're still increasing in number. Something's got to break when we max this planet out. So then what will it be? A massive culling through disease, famine, and war? Or do we ditch our biology and consume massively fewer resources respectively?
One of these scenarios will happen.
Patrick wrote:
ReplyDeleteNicotine triggers a neural response. If you were digital you could still smoke. It would taste the same, feel the same, smell the same, and may even be addicting. But it wouldn't kill you, it would be free, and you could quit at any time.
Sounds like liberation to me. I could blow past my caloric daily intake and never gain an ounce :-D
Patrick wrote:
ReplyDeleteAs a joke, I could make a "window licking" program as pleasureful as the most addictive drug. I can see it now, vast numbers of digital people spending their existence licking windows. So I'd guess one of your security protocols would be protecting the pleasure centers of your consciousness. For they can motivate you to do virtually anything. Some entity could enlist you to perform mundane tasks for a job and pay you (or enslave you) by controlling those pleasure inputs.
That's all of the nuked posts. Back to normal from here.
ReplyDeleteTo comment on Chris' post, "For the first time in history man has become one of the major forces in the process of evolution--or so it seems. But is it really evolution of man or somthing else?",
ReplyDeleteI feel that intelligence is an evolutionary entity in and of itself. In that once intelligence has evolved, it will continue advancing regardless of what platform it finds itself on. If we were silicon based, our intelligence would be evolving similarly (once sentience/awareness/consciousness has evolved).
It's a core belief (and hope) of mine that intelligence is mobile in that it can jump from one medium to another. If humans leave our biology in favor of silicon and other engineered materials, our intelligence remains intact and enhanced, even though our previous medium may cease to exist.
So then from this perspective, I would say it's "something else", and that something else would be intelligence itself.
Other planets can have radically different ecological systems, with methane lakes and elements in different proportions to that of earth. Such places would evolve very different forms of life, but the intelligences would be similar. Math is the same across the galaxy.
Came across something laughably interesting. Harold Camping believes that the "rapture" of the christians will happen on the 21st of this month. The world will then summarily end 5 years later (or 5 months, I forget). He claims roughly 3% of the human population will be included in those that are "raptured", leaving the rest of us to be destroyed. He also says that we won't be enduring eternal punishment in hell but rather be annihilated completely. Hmmm.
ReplyDeleteAdherents to his prediction are liquidating their retirement savings and possessions. I hope his followers will abandon their delusions come May 22nd. Tragic, it really is quite tragic.
I must admit I used to take such things seriously and with great hope. I'm grateful that I've been able to shed such delusional thinking. It really saddens me to see bronze-age ideologies dictating patterns of behavior in people today.
I suppose to be fair, each avenue of evolution needs its day in the sun. Religion has had quite a run but it's things like this Camping guy that signal the end is near not for the world but conversely, the ideology / theology that he proffers.
ReplyDeleteHere is really the crux of the indefinate dwelling in a computer cpu. WHO will be paying for your power needs, maintenance, upgrades etc. I would assume that every few years there would need to be maintenances and changes. Who would be earning the monies to pay for your indefinate existance. What if that person stopped paying the monthly storage and power bills? would "they" pull your plug?
ReplyDeleteWould you really be able to set up a "trust" that you could really trust to take care of these costs for the unforseen milenia to come?
Just another damn big problem in the scheme of things.
Wrenj, I used to smoke as well. I LOVED it. I would smoke today if I thought my body could handle the cancer causing chemicals--again( I have had really bad cancer once already). I still really love the smell of a freshly lit ciggarette. It's right up there with deisel bus exhaust and rubber tires and printing ink. I can't explain why I just love those smells.
ReplyDeleteOdors would seem to be one of those things that would be wiped out if we were relagated to exist inside of a data storage device. aroma and odors are such an integral part of the human experience that I thing we would no longer qualify as 100% whole persons without the ability to smell--smelling is a huge psychological component to our experience that is taken for granted.
After smoking for 10 years, I quit Nov 17, 1996.I can say you never truely loose the desire to light up every now and then. Allot of it is because it que's memories from your past.
Chris, smells are a neurological signal just like vision and taste and hearing and touch. If we have replicated the brain, don't you think we can replicate the senses too? (and allow for the emotional content that results)
ReplyDeleteAs for who runs the world and takes care of the digital masses.... that's an excellent question. Well, if you can be contained in a portable network device the size of a cell phone, couldn't you fit that into a body? Who's to say there won't be meaningful work for people in the physical world as well as the digital one? Ditching natural biology doesn't necessarily mean an end to physical existence. Just an end to being confined by it.
ReplyDelete"I regard the brain as a computer which will stop working when its components fail. There is no heaven or afterlife for broken down computers; that is a fairy story for people afraid of the dark."
ReplyDeleteStephen Hawking, 2011
I signed up today with a professional hypnotist. This lady will be regressing me to a point of past lives with the goal of getting to my inter-life state(my existance state between human lives) where I should have access to my spirit guide(s)/ guide pannel of elders who originally set me up with my current life contract. The goal is to meet these entities while still incarnate--something that very few people get to do. Normally we see these beings after we die and have our life review and before this life while establishing our life contract and goals.
ReplyDeleteOf course all of the above is conjecture until proven, so I shall see if this is for real or a total load of BS. It costs $600 dollars for the two sessions (8hrs total). I hope to discover more about the etheric realms where we come from and go back to when we are not incarnate as physical beings--I'm excited and have no real expectations either way right now. I am keeping my mind open.
Keenly interested in what you discover and especially any evidence that can be proven. Please, keep us posted!
ReplyDeleteWhen does this start?
Evidence would include information privy to you during a prior life that can be acted upon in this life. For example, you recall a memory from a prior life of burying something identifiable and then go uncover the object in this life. Better yet, tell us what this object is and then go dig up that same object that you had described. In so doing, you make this exercise statistically more significant.
ReplyDeleteIf you really believe you have something of scientific value, I would enlist some researchers from UofW to accompany you prior to any unearthing endeavors. Undergrads are trained in the scientific method and can help you engineer any experiments to hold their own merit in the face of scrutiny from the scientific community. Grad students would be better for the sake of credibility.
It would be really, REALLY cool to make the first evidence of a "fantastic event" bulletproof and world changing.
Patrick, thanks a million for all your efforts in restoring what "grubber" almost got away with.
ReplyDeleteI guess one way or another, I may eventually join the "Quit (past tense not imperative) smoking club!" I definitely would have when I'm dead.
ReplyDeleteI'll start commenting on the latest posts first and then work my way backwards.
ReplyDeleteI do not see how the work of a hypnotist can be verified. This ranks in the category of Chris's earlier OBE/NDE experience. This is not to say that what Chris experienced earlier is untrue or an illusion.
It simply means that the analogical steel door still stands firmly in front of us. We can go to the other side of our choosing. We can't return of our choosing.
The fact that we don't control the door, does not make it consistent to say there is no door or nothing on the other side.
Stephen Hawking, in this regard, is just as helpless as you and I. However, we can each choose to believe what we wish, whether our beliefs meet the test of adequacy or not.
Recall Richard Feynman's description of science...always the return to reality for a check. Reality out there, outside our minds, remains the reference for Truth.
As for the coming hypnotic experience, with the use of the word hypnosis, there's already a question mark hanging over the entire issue. It is defined as an "artificially induced trance state resembling sleep, with a heightened susceptibility to suggestion" (dictionary.com)
Now which suggestions can we become susceptible to?
Considering Patrick's reference to Harold Camping and others' susceptibility while they're wide awake (doing things with real consequences as a result) what would we then say of information absorbed in a state of hypnosis?
Chris, I must confess that I too absolutely love smoking. Does that make us weird or something?
ReplyDelete"Astral Travel" or lucid out of body experiences must begin with a trance state. The hardest "trick" is remembering what your subconscious experienced. Like recalling a dream before it dissipates. Whether Astral Travel is actually what its proponents claim or just lucid dreaming, it appears very much like hypnosis on the label. I would be interested to know if Chris' experience shares any aspects with Astral Travel.
ReplyDeleteRandom thought: consider the effects on an environment of a single fecund successful breeding pair of some species. They alter the environment in proportion to their replication. Now consider a nanotech network. It gets dropped into an environment and starts to establish itself. First building a base of operations which includes repair, research, raw material acquisition, communications, and energy. If the environment can sustain them, what would the environment look like? I was standing outside just now looking out over the landscape visualizing these little pods descending from space, filled with nanites. Wherever they land, vehicles crewed with sentient humanoid lifeforms would emerge, completely manufactured on site from local materials.
ReplyDeleteWhat a thought to share over morning coffee!
A little more about the quote from the Stephen Hawking. I think it would be more adequate to include an "If...then..." to yield a more useful statement for our purposes.
ReplyDelete"IF
I regard the brain as a computer which will stop working when its components fail,
THEN
There is no heaven or afterlife for broken down computers; that is a fairy story for people afraid of the dark."
Stephen Hawking here uses the argumentative device of reducing the human being to a computer (disputed elsewhere on this blog) as settled fact and then deriving some conclusions from it.
We'd have to take Stephen Hawking's word for that reduction. We'd have to believe him. We'd have to have faith in what he says. I disagree, because the reality outside the mind (his mind and my mind and all minds) seems to indicate otherwise.
Recall the analogy:
Human being =
f (a)
+
f (b)
+
f (c)
+
....
+
f(unknown)
and finally
+ f(mystery)
Take a computer:
Computer = f(memory) + f(processing power) + f(algorithms)
Now since computers don't come to exist miraculously...we necessarily have to add one more element:
f(modem)
It's only with a modem-like component (whether hardware of software) that it could even power up, and later do more. Without this translation component, press the power switch and nothing happens...but in actual fact there is a process of encoding (at time of manufacture), decoding (each time the computer is used) and subsequent execution.
1. Press the power switch.
2. Complete the circuit.
3. Power up ROM.
4. Do a self-check.
and on and on.
In the ROM is a set of instructions that the CPU can translate, understand and begin to execute. By necessity the modem component is already at play.
Now the two equations
Human being = f...
Computer = f...
differ by several orders of magnitude and are neither identical nor equal though they may contain a few similar elements.
Take two substances,
ReplyDeleteSulphuric Acid:
f (H), f (S), f (O)
H - Hydrogen
S - Sulfur
O - Oxygen
Penicillin:
f (R), f (H), f (O), f (S), f (C), f (N)
R - variable group that gives rise to the different kinds of penicillin
N - Nitrogen
C - Carbon
The formulas show that both Sulphuric acid and Penicillin contain identical elements but are not equal, identical and have vastly different properties and effects.
It is only by discovering the formulas of each that begin to understand some aspects of the "Why?" of both having vastly different effects.
Actually it's from the effects that we realize there is a difference and begin to work backward to the component elements.
The Singularity of Ray Kurzweil has one basic premise:
ReplyDeleteHuman being = f....
has all been worked out.
Ordinary people themselves get baffled by themselves and others. Scientists only get more awed the deeper they delve into molecular biology or the universe out there.
Now consider a song on your computer. It is stored in a specific format designed by humans taking various considerations into mind.
The song can be played by specific programs on the computer. Here file is translated by the program and then used to control the components of the speakers.
When we're transferring the file to say an iPod, a different program goes to work on the file again translating it into another kind of code which is then sent through the USB port to the music player device.
The receiving program then stitches together the received file which is then taken by the file system of the iPod and stored where the user wants it.
Finally the music player program in the iPod translates the file again when it is played and uses it to control the components of a set of speakers or earphones.
In all these cases there is full understanding of aspects of the original mp3 file by the interpreting program. In the case of the music player program, it reads the sequences of 1s and 0s, classifies into data aspects, control aspects and then plays the file. So a text file (.TXT) would make no sense if fed into a music player program.
Again the same mp3 file is read by the file-transfer program reading the 1s and 0s. It is able to successfully send the file to the iPod. It can if need be even send a Text file because it is designed to handle a greater variety of files.
The nature of the files themselves determine which programs can use them.
Right now the biological aspects of the human "file" are being understood by science. There is evidence of other bridges that transmit data to the human being. Those aspects of the file are even less understood.
ReplyDeleteIt's only with full understanding that unaltered transfer can take place.
There is no guarantee that a biological-silicon communication channel with modems on both sides will transfer the whole file. Simply because we have not worked out what the whole file is.
Again Chris's experience here indicates an existence completely independent of the biological and known material universe. He gives us a glimpse of it by describing an effect: instantaneous motion.
He did not remain sufficiently long in his OBE to experience other effects. He returned to our realm again, not of his own choosing.
Imagine putting a 3D version of the Avatar movie into the video player and plugging the audio and video cables to the printer and pressing play on the video player and print on the printer.
This is how I understand and see an attempt at transfer from the human body to silicon.
On the other hand, take the equation
ReplyDeleteHuman = f (a) + f (b)....f (mystery).
Since science is understanding some of the components a bit more clearly, it becomes possible to design technology that interfaces with specific aspects.
A simple example is the hearing aid. Once the mechanism of the ear was understood, it became possible to design hearing aids that interfaced with that specific aspect of the biological system which again is one aspect of the human being.
The more the ear is understood, the better the technology that is designed to interface with it.
The same can be applied to the eyes. Years ago there was bad eyesight and blindness. As understanding has grown about the optic system, eyeglasses, medicines, synthetic lenses have all slowly become mainstream.
We even saw technology being developed that can stimulate the visual cortex of the brain so that one day totally blind people could again begin to see. How is all this possible? Again better understanding of the optic system.
My hope is to see children taking a school trip to Mars in my lifetime and having those skateboards fitted with rockets like the green goblin had in Spider Man. The rockets though should be much faster and have greater range.
We could get to hang out on weekends in say the rift valley in Kenya.
Oops...error:
ReplyDeleteone day totally blind people could...see for the first time or see again.
PRAYER:
ReplyDeleteO blessed Patrick, the guardian angel of this blog, do not let the grubber digest my words.
I have read much, thought much, smoked much and typed much to get this far
Pray, let it all, not be in vain...cos I don't have backup!
--LOL
No worries, I have every word saved locally.
ReplyDeleteI just instructed blogger to email each comment to not only my iPhone but to a fixed computer with a unique email address so now there will be two copies of everything.
ReplyDeletef(magic) seems to be where our thoughts diverge. Neurons are digital switches like relays and transistor junctions. It's not as distant as sulphuric acid and penicillin. It's apples and apples when you consider the human brain and computers because they're both computers.
ReplyDeleteYour comments did however make me consider chemical interactions on the neural processes. Dopamine, serotonin, nicotine, etc.. chemistry targets only specific neurons and then suggests those that are targeted fire in a certain way or sequence. That's interesting. That's also an algorithm, transmitted chemically. So sure, the technology is pretty different but it's still apples and apples with no f(magic).
Today, humans and computers ARE different by several orders of magnitude. I'll give you that because it's not 35 years from now, it's still today. Consider the state of the art even 20 years ago. The 8080 processor. If you were really cool, you had the 8087 math co-processor alongside it. Then within 5 years we had the 486 and glossed over the 286 and 386 in a matter of months. Then the Pentium etc etc. (Motorola was also developing their own architectures for the Macs.)
I have taken files and altered their extensions. You can take an .mp3 file and change it to a .txt file and read the ASCII contents with a text reader. My mac will even list off several applications suitable for such a task. After cruising around the file, you can restore the extension and carry on with the .mp3 or whatever it was.
You mention the hearing aid,… have you heard of the cochlear implant? Think BORG -lol
So then, the f(human) does seem magical in comparison to the technology of today but what I ask is that we consider the possibility that it's not f(magic), just beyond our current capabilities to master and quantify.
I suspect the trends of ergonomics will continue and as the two lines converge, bio and tech, that the two will resemble each other until there is virtually no difference. Tech will go bio and bio will go tech.
Also, comparing contemporary computers to humans would also be akin to comparing humans with our evolutionary predecessors.. There's just no direct comparison other than seeing the potential evolutionary outcome and similar structures (architecture) and realizing the long term convergences. Doing this with bio vs tech is similar except the time frames are greatly accelerated.
And who's to say we don't have a boot sequence when our consciousness takes the helm every morning, or when we come out of anesthesia, or when we're born?
And to digress, the 3D>Printer analogy fails to take the timeframe into account. We are not yet to a place to attempt a transfer to silicon *today*. Where I suspect we are today is neural interfacing and attempts at neural awareness of artificial arrays. (Recall the need to text and drive). We are still at a highly primitive state, just as my first computer was compared to what's at my disposal today. As far as f(unknown) and f(magic), I'd say just wait and give technology a chance. I bet it will surprise you.
But hey, it's all irrelevant because the god of the christians is coming this saturday to bring about the beginning of the end. So we're all doomed and will never live long enough to develop technology any further. Darn.
ReplyDeleteOBE/NDE/Astral Travel just won't leave me alone though. There's something there, be it real or imagined. Too many people have experienced something that we haven't nailed down yet. It could be purely physiological but there's no proof of that. So, there being no proof on either side of the isle, I figure investigating the more interesting ideas as being just as valid as the brick and mortar science.
ReplyDeleteSomeone needs to play "tell me what's in the box" and nail it. If that happens, the world will change overnight.
f (magic) and f (mystery) are two entirely different things.
ReplyDeleteMagic points to the human control of supernatural forces or forces of nature. Often it's just a case of creating an illusion and manipulating the attention of the viewer. Later we uncover the secret and all is explained.
Mystery refers to the unexplained, the inexplicable. This is a perennial feature of life.
There are some mysteries of a material order like the disappearance of a ship or the effects of a crime or even mysteries in science.
There are other mysteries that are not yet explained like inexplicable cases of healing, which believers take as miracles. Not all cases called miracles are actually miracles. But there are cases that have no ordinary explanation.
There are other mysteries that we have probed and are still probing. Who am I? Why am I here? Why am I not a plant? Why did that happen to me? Why is this happening to me? Why is there evil and suffering? Is there a God? If so, why does He allow the mess that I often see and leaves me worn out? How could I have done that good or evil? What happens after death?
There are universal mysteries and deeply personal mysteries. I'm sure Chris would wonder why he had the experience and not others in the same room with him. And those who know Chris closely are taking his experience seriously. They too must be wondering what happened? We too.
The first time we come across a mirror, it almost seems like magic. Then later we understand the physics and all is explained.
For as long as humans have existed, we not only encounter mysteries in the world around us, but we are often a mystery to ourselves.
If death were not so mysterious, we wouldn't be chasing the "immortalities" on offer.
So true. I've found myself asking, "Would I care about digital immortality or the singularity if I knew for sure there were a spirit world offering the same thing naturally?". I would immerse myself in f(magic) and be quite content in the world, taking comfort in knowing what's to come and how I fit into all of it.
ReplyDeleteIt's quite scary to abandon all the established "fairy stories" and have nothing to replace them with aside from raw science.
Evolution is a hypothesis for which the key elements are still missing. But for some strange (or not so strange) reason it has acquired the status of dogma.
ReplyDeleteEvolution as a concept clearly can be applied to human social organizations. It perfectly fits. Again evolution within species is showing good evidence and well explains the development of features.
But evolution across species and evolution as the explanation for the appearance of man has still not met the test of scientific rigor while it has long past met with indiscriminating acceptance in some very influential quarters.
So popular (in contrast to scientifically rigorous) notions aside, this still leaves a big f(mystery) around the human being. This is why there may be similar elements between computers and humans, the similarity more being in those aspects of being human that are less mysterious to us.
Again, Chris's unaided instantaneous motion (completely unregistered by others in the room or devices in the room) in his OBE experience has no parallels except in other OBE experiences.
There are stars that have died out in the universe and we're yet to know because light travels only so fast. Chris and others are having their experiences, smack in our midst, and we're still scratching our heads.
Faith, courage, hope, good, evil are all mysterious notions and have been for a while. Along comes miracles, OBEs etc. and f(mystery) becomes only more mysterious.
Wrenj. I finally now thoroughly understand your equasion on life. Thanks much for the in depth explanations.
ReplyDeleteI really believe that the f(mystery) component to human existance is where we are different from the computer CPU in that there is this "spiritual"component. Our minds and brains being seperate components with different opperational tasks.
When I died my mind was fully in tact with a sense of self, memory both short and long term, and a physical sense(although altered). My senses were in tact although I cannot confirm smell/taste but hearing, sight, feeling/touch I can definately confirm. I suspect the reason I can't confirm smell/taste is because I wasn't breathing and breathing something is a necessary component to this sense.
I am still torn about what I think about seeing a hypnotist. It seemed like the logical thing to do in order to bring more insight into my experience(s) I don't go in to see her until June 2, 2011.
In the mean time I am further researching the validity of this area of psychology/medicine/science/ ???.
Hypnosis has the nod of the American Medical Assoc. and all of the European health care systems and is considered valid medical treatment--ESPECIALLY in the area of anastethia!. Many medical and dental proceedures are now carried out under no anastethia but simple hypnosis. This leads me to know that there is a definate mind body sensory divorce that can be instituted at will and by a third party. (divorce used for lack of a better term) It proves that by thought we can alter our perception of reality. Could they do a heart transplant under hypnosis? I don't know
It has been lended legitimaticy by the US legal system when doing research for court cases and victim recall and is considered legal evidence in many cases of high crime and assult/murder type cases.
I am very curious to know how hypnosis and the mind is viewed in the greater Asian/Indian countries as those countries have so many differing religious views and at the same time are so highly educated and full of intellectuals.
The bottom line is that there IS something there and I won't be happy until i have a really good grip on how it works and how the human mind can exist outside of the brain.
"Who am I? Why am I here? Why am I not a plant? Why did that happen to me?", the beginning questions of the consciousness question. I re-ground myself frequently by going back to the very first moment of this line of thinking. I pause my day and my thoughts and really ask myself, "why am I stuck in here?". This soon leads me in the correct orientation to focus on my consciousness objectively as a single entity.
ReplyDeleteAnd yes, why am I not a plant? Why can't I leave this body and go into another one? Do I even need a body? These questions need answers and this blog was created to find them. We can hit this from any number of angles, psychological, mathematical, experiential, economical, and common sense approaches. Eventually we will ask the right questions in such a way that the answer will be forced out, or so we can hope.
I love it that Chris is being proactive with his hypnosis regressive therapy. I sincerely hope it produces results.
I own two books by Robert Bruce on Astral Travel where he delves into the very nature of our consciousness itself and tries to understand it via the fantastic events he and others claim to be having. His approach is commendable as well; "Don't take my word for it, go try it for yourself and here's how to do it.". I've tried and have had mixed results. Then I essentially stopped my enthusiasm cold by asking if all that I experienced could've been generated by my own imagination. I couldn't refute that possibility so the whole exercise imploded in my mind. If I or others could've played the "tell me what's in the box" game with statistically significant results, this blog would not have existed and I'd be off in the aetheric dimensions right now. It's telling that nobody has ever played that game with true success. Out of the billions of us that have ever existed, where's the f(magic)?? I would love to see that as much as I would love to see digital immortality. I am afraid of the dark as Hawking puts it. I also love the truth and a good mystery. I think out of the three of us, and maybe others out there following this blog, we stand a pretty good chance at getting some pretty interesting data at the very least.
Pat, I wil try to play "what's in the box" but I'm not sure how these sessions will go and what influences the information I am privey to. The hypnotist lady did tell me in my pre-screening session that I will not be able to gleen lottery numbers stock quotes etc- highly specific info from the future.
ReplyDeleteI will be allowed to review my life contract which does have some components from the future involved. As far as specific ascertainable information from the past that I/you could research and validate, I shall try very hard. The problem with that is that if it is info that is not available today I don't see how it could then be validated. It would be subject to that Hawking paradox theory for time travel.
Wrenj touched on something I have always wondered about but have never thought through. That is; everything on our planet including us is comprised of a fairly small set of common molecules and atoms.
ReplyDeleteIs there some form of matter that could be made or in existence which is of a basic "stem cell" nature? Where simply adding or removing one or two components could be instantly made into anything physical. I'm refering to a base molecule where it could be used as a seed for teleportation expiriments. So far H is the closest thing I can think of but it's too basic. We put this "stem seed" in front of some smart beam and it instantly assembles into the form desired.
Just a wild idea!
Pat,
ReplyDeleteI hope you are enjoying your new satus as a blog god. It does seem to suit you.
Congrats on the quit smoking! I didn't realize you had really honestly quit for good this time. Maybe it'll add the extra years that need to make it into a state of VR immorality!
Yes, I've been tobacco free since August 15th, 2010. I still love the smell of it and sometimes wish I had one but it's an easy matter to refuse the temptation now.
ReplyDeleteIt seems interesting that peering into the future is restricted when the spirit world is supposed to be outside of time. The guy(s) that wrote the Astral Travel books use the phrase "somewhen" instead of "somewhere" to indicate they believe they're not confined by linear time as we in the physical are. They even report to be able to achieve super-light velocities as they have no mass and thus aren't constrained to the laws of physics. One account even said they could tour the inside of stars.
ReplyDeleteSo you have to ask yourself why the temporal restriction while in a superconscious state? It would instantly prove its validity if the restriction didn't exist.
Will you be independently recording the session(s) to make sure she's not suggesting memory content for you? In college I remember that being a huge confound to hypnotic practice. The hypnotist would suggest things in the course of questioning and actually manufacture content within the mind of the patient. Ideally, she should be like a psychiatrist, asking "how do you feel about that?" and leaving you to do the work with only small course corrections along the way.
If you record the session(s) and hear her manufacturing fantastic events and planting them into your mind, I would ask for your money back.
"blog god", nice -lol
ReplyDeleteEvolution and missing data: I have read most of the collective works of Zecharia Sitchin and among other things, he studied the ancient Sumerian / Akkadian records. These writings are the oldest known on the planet and they have an interesting tale to tell, especially about our own evolution. They, and the artifacts surrounding them lend enough evidence to validate their content as factual and not hearsay. There is still room for doubt but there is enough evidence for even me to give the nod of believability to the tales they tell.
ReplyDeleteThey also predate the bible and I've noticed that the stories they contain were borrowed by the authors of the bible. However, with a spin and significant reduction in size. The "reader's digest" version if you will. The Sumerians spoke of "gods" too, but were quite analytical about what they saw. Sure it was all f(magic) to them but they still approached the whole situation with a sound mind. Their sculptures weren't stylized images of fanciful monsters either. If you could go back in time and show these people a Buick, they would've carved a pretty good image of a Buick in stone to keep a record of the object, also including the best description they could on the event.
Such a history of humanity, with "gods" from outer space seems fanciful at best, until you look at the evidence. There's just too much to discount the whole thing out of hand.
Something else about these "gods" is they seem to appear in our evolutionary timeframe in a cyclical way. They arrive, boost our society, and leave. Humanity flourishes and then begins to decay, just in time for the "gods" to return and revitalize us with another evolutionary sociological boost. On it goes every 3000 or so years. Huh. Wonder when they're supposed to be here next? Perhaps it will be they that introduce the Singularity, our next big evolutionary step? If they want any part in the process, they better show up quick before we do it on our own. -lol
A friend suggested today that the economic model will be the reason the Singularity won't happen or if it does, will be throttled way back. He said it's all about profit. If they can't find a way to make digital integration profitable, then it won't happen unless some other group that's well funded and altruistic protects its development.
ReplyDeleteHmmm, perhaps it will require a group of gods to make it all happen?
HEAT. Our technology, which is way behind our own brains for now, runs really quite hot. Does my brain get hot when it's under load? I really don't think copper/silicon will be around for much longer as the medium / stratum of our technology. Moore's law is being threatened by the limits of physics in this regard. I'll make another prediction here on the blog;
ReplyDeleteTechnology will have a whole new medium in the next 10 years.
Furthermore, I'll bet the new medium will take us in the right direction to the bio / tech convergence I wrote of earlier.
I'll bet it'll be much more energy efficient and thermally cooler.
I'll bet it will allow another order of magnitude of miniaturization and circuit density. "Gray matter" if you will.
It'll make the ideas of this blog seem almost inevitable.
Interesting thought.... en route to this convergence, maybe we could have technology augmenting our own brains that would allow us to better understand what's going on when we experience fantastic events. Like when Chris is interfacing the controllers of his destiny. Upon his return, he'll be able to see exactly what was going on physiologically in his mind during that same timeframe.
ReplyDeleteIt may not hold the smoking gun of evidence but it will at least offer insight and data that may help us understand f(mystery) a little better. -just a thought.
Electron flow on the surface of the metal/mineral is what produces the heat right?. I suppose it is due to friction between molecules or else collisions between electrons.I realize that the textbok says that resistance/inductance is the cause of the heat but what IS resistance/inductance besides friction.
ReplyDeleteAll we need to do is elevate the electrons onto a magnetic cushion off of the copper or conductor and loose this friction. There would no longer be the interferance of the conductor's molecular surface with electron transfer.
Nikola Tesla was touting this idea way back when he was working on wireless transmission of electricity. You shoot a path of "electronic gas" and within this jet of gas you can have a zero resistance super conductor--no heat waste. Same idea but using magnetics to contain the electron pathway.
Would that even work? Could I make a circuit on a glass or whatever substraight with a magnetite/magnetic carbon based conductive path where the electron flow gets raised onto the skin of the magnetic field? I can see it as kind of a reverse electro-magnet where electron flow becomes the "field effect" of the magnetic core.
Maybe I'm just thinking out of my ass but it seems simple and like it just might be valid.
This leaves us with room temp super conductivity!
As far as getting hypnotized, yes the session includes a video recording on a DVD.
ReplyDeleteI did ask her how the whole suggestive thing works and she said she will be queing me but will not be putting ideas in my head for me to expound on. She said it is more or less an interview and I just report what I see and hear.
I do need to prepare list of questions and give her an idea of what I want to dig for. I have never done this so aside from reading up on life between lives I can't even begin to know what to expect.
I think if I go back for an extra follow up session at that time I could really get very specific as far as what I want to ask myself in the alternate dimention. She claims that it is "unethical" for her to use foresight to make profit in an un-natural way and that there would be a "high price to pay". I will probe her further about this, as this could just be the area where some real validation could occur.
We shall see!
Electronic gas, that's awesome! The conductivity of air goes up when it's heated. Consider the plasma torch. Cool it down and resistance goes up I would assume. Electrons travel on the surface of a conductor with penetration being a function of the frequency of the current. DC goes through the conductor. AC travels on the skin. This is called "skin effect". Microwave frequencies are barely in contact hence how waveguides can work. "G-line" also works due to this phenomenon but must remain absolutely straight. G-line is a single conductor with waveguide horns at either end. The losses along this transmission line are extremely low at microwave frequencies but it's impractical in most applications.
ReplyDeleteTake the frequency even higher and you get into lightwaves and they don't penetrate conductors at all. "Skin Effect" is the proper term for this and that would be the term to Google for further study.
Anyway, if it's not traveling through a conductor, then it's traveling through something if not in a perfect vacuum. This means resistance of some kind which directly translates to heat. So then, this is an f(mystery) why our brains don't get hot under load. I would like an answer to that one.
OMG everyone, tomorrow is the end of the world. (Harold Camping's prediction). I wonder what time this is all supposed to go down? I wonder how long Blogger will remain functional once all the christians are gone? How are we going to cope? Will god have mercy on all the people that are left or are we just going to be smitten by his wrath? Guess we'll know on Sunday.
ReplyDeleteYes- Patrick, Have you been to church lately?
ReplyDeleteI never had hear of "Harold Camping" prior to this hoax. What a scam! How can anyone with an IQ over 75 seriously believe in this guy?
ReplyDeleteMost rare gasses have conductive ability and can become a form of"electronic gas".Take neon for example it excites and flows a high voltage and produces light to boot. I need to re read my Tesla Book and find where he was working out these details.
ReplyDeleteThe thought I have also had running around my head is this: Maybe the reason that magnetic fields can produce "spiritual" feelings and sensations in the brain are because the spirit realms are operate in a magnetic subspectrum.
ReplyDeleteI think there might be a way to isolate different bandwidths within the magnetic spectrum. These would be similar to energy bands of radio, light , and radiation but different forms of magnetism. We have a handle on magnetic flux inducing voltage etc, we see the effects of magnetism but it seems like there has to be more to it. So I'm on a new found quest.
By now, according to Camping, half the world should be under "Fiery Chaos". Hmmm, seems quiet so far. -lol
ReplyDeleteChris, I think you're referring to the "God Helmet". A device made by researcher Michael Persinger. He uses electromagnetic fields on the brain to stimulate certain feelings. It's really quite interesting. Google him.
ReplyDeleteIf you're still able to that is. After the christians are gone, it's going to be pure pandemonium as all of us sinners will be under judgement for our evil ways. Better Google it fast before you end up in hell. -lmao
ReplyDeleteChris, check out:
ReplyDeletehttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nCVzz96zKA0
You know, I can't help but notice a feeling when I consider the state of the art in our area of focus... it feels just like it did when I was getting into serious computing back in the 80's. There was an interest but also a primitiveness about it all too. And now look how far we've come since then. If nano-tech and AI are giving me the same "feeling" today, then I sincerely hope it's a reliable indicator of where we'll be in the future.
ReplyDeleteRandom thought... FOSSILIZATION,
ReplyDeleteWhen something becomes fossil, minerals take the place of organic matter. So when you see a fossil, you're not looking at the actual bone but rather minerals that have leached in through the parent rock and taken its place, molecule by molecule.
Now consider nano-tech. I believe such replacement will be the way of our eventual augmentation. Recall the convergence theory I spoke of, this will completely bypass the whole "age of robots" that have been so popular in movies (Bicentennial Man, etc.). Unless you really want to look like a metal robot, I don't think we'll ever see them.
This will also be the key to my reaching the age where digital immortality will be a viable option. As nano-tech evolves, it will invariably be used to augment my other organs and tissues hence aiding in my longevity. Then the holy grail will happen, neural replacement....one nano-device at a time. Before long I will have become 100% artificial. Downloading my consciousness into another device will by that time be ancillary and "no big deal".
Check out:
ReplyDeletehttp://www.thenanoage.com/virtual-reality.htm
The YouTube video at the bottom of the page is worth watching too
I've made an assumption. Consequently I'm guilty of technological myopia. I've assumed the ultimate end to this evolution will be similar to the liquid metal guy in the movie Terminator 2.
ReplyDeleteWho's to say the spiritual realm, if it exists, isn't technology in its own right? I'm not saying that it is, just asking "what if".
Furthermore, let's analyze some assumptions:
ReplyDelete1) Our unique consciousness must necessarily be hosted by a network.
2) We are software that is dependent upon said network.
3) Time may suspend for us indefinately but we can resume if the memory isn't erased. (Freezing one's brain might actually just work IF the memory is stable without being energized).
So then, can a network exist in other dimensions like the "spirit world" etc? Are such dimensions capable of maintaining complex arrays or structures necessary for making a network like the human brain?
Funny thought; "Are you a PC or a Mac" has humorous connotations in the context of this blog, don't you think?
ReplyDeleteHmmm, test
ReplyDelete